Craig Cannon, head of marketing at Y Combinator and host of the Y Combinator podcast, discusses podcasting trends and the Y Combinator podcast with Adora Cheung. They talk about the initial motivation for starting the podcast, which was to create content for a YouTube channel with good SEO. They also discuss podcast metrics, tips for creating a successful podcast, picking episode topics, finding guests, and preparing for interviews. They touch on gear and software for podcasting, as well as the challenges of clipping podcast episodes for YouTube. They also talk about monetizing podcasts and the future of the podcasting industry. The conversation covers influential podcasters, Adora's podcast picks, and the pressure to start a company while at Y Combinator. They also discuss when an opportunity is good enough to quit a current job.
Adora's intro
- Adora Cheung, a partner at Y Combinator, interviews Craig Cannon, the head of marketing at Y Combinator and host of the Y Combinator podcast.
- They discuss podcasting trends, how to do it correctly, and the Y Combinator podcast itself.
- Adora asks Craig about his background and how he ended up at Y Combinator.
Craig's intro
Craig Cannon, originally from Boston, started his career at The Onion after graduating as an English major. He later founded Comedy Hack Day, a hackathon series that brought together developers and comedians. After a five-month bike tour, he received a contract offer from Luke Iseman to work on a blog, which led him into podcasting.
Starting the YC podcast
Starting the YC podcast was initially motivated by the desire to create content for a YouTube channel with good SEO. Despite podcasts having terrible SEO, they decided to use podcasts as a way to generate content and then spread it through YouTube. The success of Joe Rogan's podcast and his YouTube channel's views matching his podcast's downloads were also mentioned.
Key points:
- Initial motivation was to create content for a YouTube channel with good SEO
- Podcasts have terrible SEO, so they used podcasts to generate content and spread it through YouTube
- Joe Rogan's podcast success and his YouTube channel's views matching podcast downloads were mentioned
Podcast metrics
The main aspect of podcast metrics is driving applications, which is the primary metric used to measure success. The podcast started with 2-3 thousand automatic subscribers and now has 40 thousand subscribers per episode, with YouTube views ranging from 1 thousand to 100 thousand depending on the guest.
- The main goal of the podcast is to educate and bring in founders.
- Driving applications is the primary metric used to measure success.
- The podcast has grown from 2-3 thousand automatic subscribers to 40 thousand subscribers per episode.
- YouTube views range from 1 thousand to 100 thousand depending on the guest.
Tips on creating a podcast
Creating a successful podcast requires commitment and careful planning. Here are some key tips to keep in mind:
- Determine your commitment level and be prepared for the long-term nature of podcasting.
- Understand that growth in metrics may not be immediate, so be patient and persistent.
- Brainstorm and plan topics for each episode to ensure a consistent flow of content.
- Set up a basic recording setup and consider recording multiple episodes before releasing any.
Picking episode topics
Picking episode topics for a podcast involves selecting topics that appeal to a wide audience, including those outside the tech industry. Key points include:
- Creating a tech podcast that interests both founders and non-tech individuals.
- Focusing on technology as a core topic, while also discussing art, science, and entrepreneurship.
- Considering guests with a following, but also prioritizing the topic of the episode when selecting guests.
Order of operations for finding guests
The order of operations for finding guests for a podcast involves asking for recommendations, finding trends and interesting topics, and booking guests. It is similar to starting a startup, requiring audience validation, cold emailing and outreach, and continuous learning.
Key points:
- Ask for recommendations and find trends and interesting topics
- Booking guests can be both easy and hard, with some declining due to brand connotations
- The process is similar to starting a startup, requiring audience validation, cold emailing and outreach, and continuous learning.
Preparing for interviews
Preparing for interviews in podcasting involves researching previous interviews to understand the guest's interests and avoid repetitive questions for familiar topics. For unfamiliar topics, spend time listening to talks, reading articles, and taking notes to ask intelligent questions without overwhelming the audience with jargon. Last-minute preparation may be required due to unexpected circumstances. Challenges include keeping the podcast engaging and interesting, especially when interviewing chill or intimidating guests. The speaker also mentions their struggle with nervous laughter during interviews.
How to keep an episode engaging
To keep an episode engaging, follow these key points:
- Establish a comfortable and open atmosphere for guests by discussing expectations and norms before recording.
- Edit the episode to remove slow or uninteresting content, especially in the first few minutes.
- Start with a thought-provoking question instead of a softball question.
- Avoid asking safe questions and challenge the guests to maintain interest.
- Learn from examples like the Joe Rogan and Elon Musk episode, which lacked engagement due to the lack of challenging questions.
Analytics
Analytics in podcasting, particularly with Apple Analytics, have limitations in tracking detailed retention data. Podcast hosts can only track basic information such as the number of downloads. Apple dominates as a podcast player, followed by a dominant player on Android. Other essential tools for podcasting include software and gear.
Gear
The most profound aspect of the topic of gear for podcasting is that one should not let their gear disqualify them from starting a podcast.
- Minimum viable gear for podcasting is a phone
- Starting a podcast with simple gear, such as a zoom recorder and inexpensive microphones
- Option of using a USB microphone like the Blue Yeti
- Importance of finding a suitable room for recording, including the use of portable sound-blocking walls to eliminate echo
- Use of headphones can be annoying when recording
- Use of Shure SM7B microphones and a Mix Pre 6 sound device for better audio quality
- Use of iPhone or Zoom H4n recorder for recording interviews in person
- Use of USB mic like Blue Yeti for remote interviews conducted over Skype
- Brief mention of podcasting software for recording online
Software
- Podcasting involves recording, editing, and serving audio content
- Software like Audacity can be used for editing and exporting audio
- Adding an intro or other clips to the podcast is common
- Backtracks can be used for serving the podcast
- Getting used to one's own voice is important in podcasting
Listening to your own voice
Listening to your own voice can be a challenging experience, as it often sounds different when recorded. Many people dislike the sound of their own voice and may manipulate it in post-production to match their internal perception. Additionally, seeing oneself on video can lead to negative feelings about appearance.
Favorite interviews
- The speaker shares their favorite interviews from their podcast, including Leonard Susskind, Michelle Qu Oh, Ryan Peterson, Rosalyn Watts, and Matt Hackett.
- They express surprise at the level of detail in the psilocybin mushroom interview.
Most surprising things Craig's learned about startups on the podcast
The most surprising thing Craig has learned about startups from interviewing founders is the importance of confidence and how it plays a significant role in their success.
Key points:
- Successful founders have the confidence to pursue their ideas and do not disqualify themselves from starting.
- Confidence is a learned trait that can be developed.
- Aspiring founders need to believe in themselves and just "do the thing."
- Maintaining optimism and thinking about the potential impact of their startup is crucial.
- Taking risks in Silicon Valley is not as risky as it may seem.
- Pursuing ambitious projects like building rockets can attract more people to work with.
What has Craig learned from guests that he's put into practice?
Craig Cannon has learned several things from his podcast guests that he has put into practice.
- He has become anxious about doing his own thing, such as starting a startup, after interviewing many successful people.
- He admires how his guests are able to focus on their own work despite being a passing moment in someone else's life.
- Sam Altman encouraged him to "just do the thing," which has been helpful.
- He has learned from Tim Wong, who is able to maintain cool jobs while having side hustle projects, and has an unprecedented work ethic.
- He has realized that it doesn't take much to generate a real following online by writing and communicating clearly, which is a core principle of Y Combinator.
Non-consensus things about building startups
Successful startups are often early in the market and focused on solving big problems rather than following trends. It is important to be able to explain the problem and solution without using jargon. The mechanism of solving the problem is not the main focus, but rather the problem itself. Building a successful startup is similar to creating good content or a good product.
If Craig had to start a podcast from scratch, how would he structure it?
- Craig Cannon's current podcast reflects his personal taste and how he likes shows to go
- If it were a non-YC podcast, he would include more strange and weird people
- He discusses the branding aspect and the challenge of receiving feedback from multiple bosses
- Despite that, he would still make the podcast more weird and include sillier people
- He emphasizes the importance of YouTube, transcripts, and clipping the show for YouTube
- Having big names as guests still works well
Clipping the show
The most profound aspect of the topic is the benefits and challenges of clipping podcast episodes for YouTube.
Key points:
- Clipping the show into shorter videos can attract more listeners and improve SEO.
- Overwhelming viewers with too many videos in a short period of time is a challenge.
- Having a pre-existing audience for the clips channel is important for a flywheel effect.
- YouTube has a younger audience compared to other platforms.
- Instagram is another platform where podcast clips perform well.
- Targeting small but tightly networked communities can lead to wider dissemination of episodes.
- Having guests adjacent to the startup tech industry can attract a different audience.
- The future of podcasting is promising, but effective clipping of episodes is a major challenge.
Monetizing podcasts
The future of podcast monetization could involve podcasters signing contracts with big companies like Spotify to be paid directly. There may be a decrease in CPM (cost per thousand impressions) for podcast advertising. Patreon-like models and tipping could also become popular ways to monetize podcasts. Additionally, there is potential for the emergence of super expensive podcasts that listeners would be willing to pay a higher price for.
Key points:
- Podcasters may sign contracts with companies like Spotify for direct payment
- CPM for podcast advertising may decrease
- Patreon-like models and tipping could be used for monetization
- Super expensive podcasts could emerge, similar to master classes or audiobooks
The podcast market is currently valued at $300 million in advertising revenue. However, there is a gap in monetizing podcasts, especially in the educational content space. This presents an opportunity for a new platform like Himalaya to capture this market.
Will podcasts become saturated?
- The idea of podcast saturation is a false premise
- Comparisons are made to the abundance of music and blogs
- Quantity does not equate to saturation
What's missing in the podcast world?
The missing element in the podcast world is a lack of monetization and commitment from podcasters.
Key points:
- Many podcasters do it on the side or already have a product, so there needs to be a shift towards recognizing the value of podcasting and paying podcasters a basic income salary.
- This would motivate them to create high-quality content and prevent the large number of dead podcasts that never gain traction.
- The suggestion is for platforms like Spotify to adopt a model similar to Netflix, where they commit to a certain number of episodes and provide financial support.
- This could involve hiring multiple podcasters at a reasonable salary to create content that resonates with listeners.
Influential podcasters
Influential podcasters are discussed in this video, with Joe Rogan, Russ Roberts, and the YC podcast being highlighted. Other notable podcasts mentioned include "7th Avenue Projects," "Barbell Medicine," and "Dead Authors Podcast." The conversation covers a range of topics such as science, weightlifting, medical research, and comedy. The host also mentions the Berkshire Hathaway board meeting podcast and the skateboarding podcast "Nine Club." Craig Cannon, the host, shares his experience with various podcasts, including one by Seth Godin. The conversation also touches on podcast discovery and the potential for a podcast app similar to YouTube clipping.
Adora's podcast picks
- Adora Cheung enjoys listening to podcasts as a form of relaxation and entertainment.
- She specifically enjoys tech podcasts because they allow her to multitask while listening.
- Podcasts serve as a break from audiobooks and music for Adora.
Patrick Bender asks - What idea do you believe in that your social group would think is crazy?
Cushy internet jobs hinder innovation and should have term limits, with forced sabbaticals after a certain number of years to encourage creativity and prevent stagnation. The sabbatical should be longer than the time spent at the company, possibly around six months, and incentives should be provided for employees to not return to their previous jobs. The conversation also covers topics such as funding internal startup projects, employee retention, and the challenges of staying focused on one idea while being exposed to multiple startup ideas at Y Combinator.
Zachary Canann asks - Please tell us about the time you most successfully hacked some (non-computer) system to your advantage.
- The speaker shares a story about successfully hacking a non-computer system to their advantage.
- They participated in a cycling trend and created a spreadsheet to find the best hills in the East Bay for their cycling goals.
- This allowed them to achieve their goal and have a successful outcome.
Being at YC, do Craig and Adora feel pressured to go start a company?
Craig and Adora, both being at Y Combinator, discuss whether they feel pressured to start their own companies. They both admit to feeling the pressure, as working at YC is surrounded by a culture of solo founders. Craig mentions that he is interested in developing a product in the space of simpler lives and more freedom, possibly focusing on a housing solution. Adora expresses her interest in ideas related to improving life in cities, such as starting new cities, mobility, and housing.
- Craig and Adora feel pressured to start their own companies while at Y Combinator.
- Craig is interested in developing a product for simpler lives and more freedom, potentially in the housing space.
- Adora is interested in ideas related to improving life in cities, such as starting new cities, mobility, and housing.
When is an opportunity good enough to quit your current job?
When considering whether to quit your current job for a new opportunity, it is crucial to find the right team and be passionate about the problem you are solving. The opportunity should be compelling enough to avoid distractions from new ideas. Carefully evaluate your level of interest before making the decision to quit.